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Times 25147 - but did 19 16 the wheel?

Solving time : 17:53 on a printout - but I was still feeling a little uneasy about two of the answers, so I went to the Crossword Club and typed them in carefully - it came back at a correct puzzle, so woohoo! I have mixed feelings about this one - it's a tricky crossword, but there's four names, a country a nationality, an island... that's a lot of capitalization!

However in the end everything makes sense except 26 down, but it's going to be a tough time looking for one to leave out, there's lots of cryptic tricks going on.

Away we go!

Across
1LAPLANDER: one that lands in the lap has fallen easily
6WIDOW: WINDOW(opportunity) without the N and a crafty definition
9COTERIE: (EROTIC)* then E from the heart of dukEdom. Another well-hidden definition
10DISGUST: that's G(grand) U(posh) ST(thoroughfar) after the DIS
11SEE: hooly dooly - that's a quadruple definition
12CAESARS,A,LAD
14EMBODY: MB then OD in E(drug),Y
15CORAL SEA: (RACE,ALSO)*
17HOME BREW: MO reversed in HEBREW
19EDISON: NO SIDE (the end of a rugby match) reversed
22U,PA,GAINS,TIT
23OOH: alternating letters in dOrOtHy
25TIMBALE: LAB(party) reversed in TIME - got this from the wordplay
27FEAR,GAL: Only got this one by thinking of the one-hit wonder from the mid-80s
28let's leave this one out from the acrosses
29TO A DEGREE: TOAD,EG(say),RE(on),E(tip of tonguE)
 
Down
1LOCUS(t): I liked "Leggy stripper" for LOCUST
2POT HERB: POTHER(fuss), then B(second-rate)
3ABRACADABRA: I think this is C,ADA in A,BRA,BRA but I don't see where the second BRA comes from. Is she wearing two?
4DIESEL: DIES(drops) then (f)EL(l)
5RED BARON: RED(wine) then O in BARN(store)
6let's omit this from the downs
7DOUGLAS: UGL(y) in DO AS
8WITHDRAWN: DR in WITH AWN(having beard)
13STAND AT EAST: or STAND A TEASE
14EXHAUSTED: H in (TAXES,DUE)*
16REINVENT: REIN(lead), VENT(pipe) and another nice definition
18MYANMAR: M(maiden) then (MAN,RAY)* - the country formally known as Burma
20SLOGGER: double definition
21STAFFA: reversed first letters of Away From Fire As The Smoke
24HALVE: H then AL(i)VE
26ASS: from definition, but I'm not sure what it's half of - ASSAIL maybe? Edit: ASSIST for "pitch in" - see comments

Comments

( 70 comments — Leave a comment )
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mctext
Apr. 26th, 2012 04:41 am (UTC)
Untimed ...
... but a good part of the morning. Sorry I can't help with the other half of ASS??? or ???ASS at 26dn. And equally perplexed by the two BRAs: owning, perhaps, rather than wearing? Not at all helped by so many proper nouns and trying to justify CAESARS = "Classics masters". Not to mention missing the golfing reference at 24dn. COD has to go to 21dn, STAFFA, for a very deceptive surface.
(Anonymous)
Apr. 26th, 2012 04:45 am (UTC)
26D - It's half of ASSIST - pitch in
ulaca
Apr. 26th, 2012 04:54 am (UTC)
75 minutes, finishing in the tough SW with ASS and finally REINVENT, having finally tumbled to the unknown TIMBALE. Lots of deviously good stuff here, with my COD going to the beautifully clued REINVENT, with an honourable mention to COTERIE, an excellent anagram appearing to contain too many vowels to be a word.

Similar head-scratching at 26, so thanks to Anon for clearing that up.
dtelconvert
Apr. 26th, 2012 05:02 am (UTC)
Glad to help - and now not anonymous, so all my stupidities will now be revealed...
ulaca
Apr. 26th, 2012 06:32 am (UTC)
I've been enviously eying your times on the Club site. Welcome aboard!
(no subject) - dtelconvert - Apr. 26th, 2012 06:59 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - ulaca - Apr. 26th, 2012 08:09 am (UTC) - Expand
jackkt
Apr. 26th, 2012 06:01 am (UTC)
DNF without resort to aids but got there eventually.

I'd say this was a puzzle of two halves for me except the split was nearer 75/25 with all but 10 clues solved within 30 minutes including the whole of the top half, most of the SW and a couple in the SE. I then stared at the grid for the next 30 minutes without writing in a single answer before deciding to use aids to get myself started again. 20 minutes later the grid was complete but I needed still more time to sort out all the wordplay.

To my shame I didn't know MYANMAR and couldn't work it out despite realising it was an anagram and having identified the grist correctly.

I'm still not sure I understand how the definition works at 16dn. I didn't know the necessary sporting references 'no side' (rugby) at 19ac and 'HALVE' (golf) at 24dn.

26dn was ASS(ail) for me but I see now that ASS(ist) is a better fit.

This was a good day for me not to be blogging. Congrats to George for rattling through it all so swiftly.

Edited at 2012-04-26 06:28 am (UTC)
ulaca
Apr. 26th, 2012 06:30 am (UTC)
16dn
Think Frankie Howerd: 'Coin [ye] not!' If you reinvent something, then necessarily you are not inventing (or 'coining' it).

Edited at 2012-04-26 06:30 am (UTC)
Re: 16dn - jackkt - Apr. 26th, 2012 06:44 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: 16dn - mctext - Apr. 26th, 2012 06:53 am (UTC) - Expand
martinp1
Apr. 26th, 2012 07:01 am (UTC)
That was a tough one! Leaving out a trip to the supermarket to return some ribs that my wife had bought but hadn't realised were off, that took just under 2hrs. Thanks to everyone, including our esteemed blogger, for helping out with the queries I had on REINVENT, STAFFA and ASS. I, too, am puzzled by the doubling up of bras. LOI was REINVENT and COD among many excellent candidates was 19ac. Lastly, I saw on the TV news the other night that the USN has sent a goodly-sized contingent, including one of their huge aircraft carriers, to Fremantle to help celebrate the 70th anniversary of the Battle of the 15ac.
ulaca
Apr. 26th, 2012 07:57 am (UTC)
Bras
I think the point here is that 'underwear' is a mass or non-count noun like 'clothing', and thus may be exemplified by two items, in this case, the setter's favourite piece of lingerie.
keriothe
Apr. 26th, 2012 08:45 am (UTC)
DNF
20m for all but 16dn, and another ten minutes before giving up on it. Others seem to love the clue so I must just be in a grump but I'm not a fan. "Coin not necessarily" is just too oblique a definition for me. I don't see how "rein" means "lead" either: missing something obvious no doubt.
Presumably I'm being thick on 12ac too but I don't understand it. Is the definition "course supplement"? In my experience a Caesar Salad is invariably a course in itself. And does "classics masters" clue "Caesars"? How does that work?
Otherwise, lots of unknown stuff in here that resulted in many answers bunged in without full understanding. All in all a puzzle that made me feel very thick: not a very enjoyable experience!
ulaca
Apr. 26th, 2012 09:01 am (UTC)
Re: DNF
I'm familiar with lead rein as some kind of equine accoutrement, but will leave it to someone horsier than me to fill in the bits.
Re: DNF - jackkt - Apr. 26th, 2012 09:17 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: DNF - keriothe - Apr. 26th, 2012 09:26 am (UTC) - Expand
Re reins - z8b8d8k - Apr. 26th, 2012 09:27 am (UTC) - Expand
z8b8d8k
Apr. 26th, 2012 09:22 am (UTC)
30 minutes with TIMBALE as a tentative entry (it could have been TIMBILE but probably not TIMNOCE), ASS with pitch being almost anything, and REINVENT with both rein=lead and vent=pipe questioned. I assumed the definition was the full "Coin not necessarily found" and hoped for the best.
The rest of this thing was a delight, I thought, full of those admirable narrative clues which make decent sense and enhance the game of hunt the definition.
Slowed by having HITCH at 24 - hard breathing either haitch or h-aitch (according to taste) minus a one, and you can't argue with the definition. It made the SE much harder to solve, but at least it was fair: the SW needed at least three acts of faith for me.
CAESARS didn't make me blink - they were the masters of the Classical world, after all, and I thought the grammar was within the bounds of normal crossword deviousness.
Many candidates for CoD: DIESEL might well have made it in another puzzle, but UP AGAINST IT made me smile most.
keriothe
Apr. 26th, 2012 09:41 am (UTC)
I didn't understand vent = pipe either but I thought I'd moaned enough! Chambers has "a pipe-like volcanic vent" for "pipe", but I doubt that was the intention.
dorsetjimbo
Apr. 26th, 2012 09:32 am (UTC)
A very difficult puzzle so well done George on two counts, your time and your parsing.

I filled the grid in just under 30 minutes but took at least another 10 to understand some of these. At the end of that I still don't understand: 12A "supplement given by Classics masters" assuming the definition is "course"; the leading ABR in 3D assuming it's ABR-A(C-ADA)BRA which is what the wording suggests - don't buy the suggestions already given; the "coin not necessarily" at 16D despite the explanations already given.

Well done setter and would welcome your explanation of the clues not generally understood
ulaca
Apr. 26th, 2012 09:40 am (UTC)
3 and 12
George's parsing of 3 seems good to me for reasons already given. At 12, 'Caesar Salad' is frequently on menus in these parts at any rate as a side dish, which would make it a 'course supplement'.
Re: 3 and 12 - dorsetjimbo - Apr. 26th, 2012 09:49 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: 3 and 12 - ulaca - Apr. 26th, 2012 11:05 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: 3 and 12 - dorsetjimbo - Apr. 26th, 2012 11:36 am (UTC) - Expand
(Anonymous)
Apr. 26th, 2012 10:43 am (UTC)
The setter replies ...
In response to Jimbo, to whom thanks for kind comments, and thanks also to George the blogger (I am taking "hooly dooly" to be a compliment!)
But as always all comments, favourable and otherwise, are useful and appreciated.
ABRACADABRA is indeed (C ADA in BRA BRA) all under A. In the world of the crossword clue I think it's perfectly acceptable for someone to be "dressed" in two bras, cryptically if not literally. The "bra" is only appreciated by this setter as an item of underwear if the hackneyed "supporter" can be avoided, although that doesn't always apply. If "supporter" fits a nice surface then so be it..
In CAESAR'S SALAD the definition is indeed "course supplement" but I agree "course" would have done equally well if not better.
REINVENT: "Rein" and "lead" are a loose equivalence I admit, but I think one can just about get away with it figuratively. (BTW my experience of reins and leads for children, dogs and horses is that there may be a fair degree of "pulling" and "being pulled" in any combination)
I also agree that the definition for this clue could have been phrased better.
I'm pleased George remembers Feargal Sharkey - a one-hit wonder as a solo artist but not of course but not with his Undertones colleagues.
dorsetjimbo
Apr. 26th, 2012 11:30 am (UTC)
Re: The setter replies ...
Many thanks setter - much appreciated
Re: The setter replies ... - melrosemike - Apr. 26th, 2012 04:02 pm (UTC) - Expand
Re: The setter replies ... - ulaca - Apr. 27th, 2012 01:15 am (UTC) - Expand
Re: The setter replies ... - melrosemike - Apr. 27th, 2012 02:21 pm (UTC) - Expand
Re: The setter replies ... - ulaca - Apr. 27th, 2012 03:23 pm (UTC) - Expand
Re: The setter replies ... - melrosemike - Apr. 27th, 2012 04:38 pm (UTC) - Expand
vinyl1
Apr. 26th, 2012 11:06 am (UTC)
Solved correctly without aids...
....but pretty tough. I agree with a lot of the quibbles, but it is hard to make a hard puzzle and have everything obvious.

I don't really have any problem with 'underwear' as plural, or 'Caesar salad' as a course supplement, but I thought both 'slogger' and 'reinvent' were just a bit of a stretch.

Thanks for the explanation of 'Edison', it had to be him but I couldn't see why.
ulaca
Apr. 26th, 2012 11:23 am (UTC)
Re: Solved correctly without aids...
SLOGGER is the mandatory cricket reference, a slogger being a batsman who favours brawn over style. His favourite destination for the ball is 'cow corner', which may come up one day if it hasn't already.
choosytoo
Apr. 26th, 2012 11:20 am (UTC)
26dn
i got it from MORASS...... i think the link is wallow - morass - pitch.
(Anonymous)
Apr. 26th, 2012 11:21 am (UTC)
Was I the only person who had Truman for19 across?
(Anonymous)
Apr. 26th, 2012 11:31 am (UTC)
tricky one today, not sure about ass/morass, but loved 17ac. almost worth the £1 for the paper alone.
(Anonymous)
Apr. 26th, 2012 11:36 am (UTC)
feargal sharkey
was a two-hit wonder. also did 'you little thief' . .
(Anonymous)
Apr. 26th, 2012 12:05 pm (UTC)
No side?
can't seem to use login details off an iPhone, the anonymous drop down menu doesnt do as it should.

Can anyone elucidate the "no side" = end of game idea?
I thought I knew rugby but dont get this!
keriothe
Apr. 26th, 2012 12:16 pm (UTC)
Re: No side?
I didn't know this either but Collins defines "no side" as "the end of a match signalled by the referee's whistle".
Re: No side? - grestyman - Apr. 26th, 2012 07:19 pm (UTC) - Expand
crypticsue
Apr. 26th, 2012 12:14 pm (UTC)
20 mins for me with reinvent holding me up the longest. Loved the quadruple definition in 11a and ooh indeed to 23a. Thanks to the anonymous setter and to George for sorting it all out.
daveperry
Apr. 26th, 2012 12:29 pm (UTC)
59:27
Squeaked in under the hour for this tricky puzzle. I found lots to like and a little to dislike here. I loved 'leggy stripper' and 'woman left' as definitions. 21 & 14a were both excellent clues. I didn't like the quadruple-breasted girl at 3. There were a few other clues I wasn't keen on at the time, but now that I fully understand them they seem OK - 12, 16 & 26. I'm definitely appreciating it more now that I've perused the blog.
Much like Jack, I'm very glad it wasn't my turn to write it. Well done George.
sotira
Apr. 26th, 2012 12:42 pm (UTC)
24:41 .. with a good deal of checking and rechecking at the end. Very nice challenge.

The one that I spent most time on post-solve was TO A DEGREE. Am I being dim or, if 'on'='RE', doesn't the wordplay lead to TO A DEGERE ? Or ER E TOADEG ? Is it in fact 'touching' that gives 'RE', and does that make sense? I don't know. I've puzzled myself into submission.

Oh, (and here I reveal yet more ignorance) what's STAFFA got to do with 'inch'?
keriothe
Apr. 26th, 2012 12:56 pm (UTC)
Yes I think "touching" gives RE. Chambers gives "concerning" for "touching".
STAFFA is an island. An inch is an island.
(no subject) - sotira - Apr. 26th, 2012 01:20 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - dorsetjimbo - Apr. 26th, 2012 01:23 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - sotira - Apr. 26th, 2012 02:04 pm (UTC) - Expand
heaton_daniel
Apr. 26th, 2012 12:55 pm (UTC)
A steady solve for the most part but ended two short with Reinvent and Slogger missing.

Edison from definition – hadn’t heard of the rugby term “no side.”

Super mix of clues for the three-letter words – none of which I got immediately.
kororareka
Apr. 26th, 2012 01:33 pm (UTC)
DNF having put FEARSAL at 22, I could only think of SCOUSER or SPONSOR for 20, and thought neither likely, although was prepared to countenance the former as some kind of cyptic definition I didn't get. I toughie but a goodie; I didn't have any problems with the answers, just in getting them, or not.
janie_l_b
Apr. 26th, 2012 01:38 pm (UTC)
A toughie, today...

Somehow managed all the sporting refs (SLOGGER, HALVE, EDISON), but came a cropper in top right, where I couldn't get LAPLANDER or LOCUS.

Also had a gap at REINVENT, where I couldn't get away from trying to use 'cent' as the coin. You know the feeling, where you just KNOW it's got to be that...

Not too many unknowns here today: AWN, I think is the only bit, and somehow I'm not surprised when I find that it means: 'Bristly appendage (of corn or grass)' - not sure I'll ever need that one again (except of course for the next time it crops up here). For me at least, very tricksy cryptics. Thanks, setter, blogger and all you guys for the interesting debate.

Edited at 2012-04-26 01:40 pm (UTC)
(Anonymous)
Apr. 26th, 2012 03:00 pm (UTC)
staffa
Inch (Inch Kenneth?) is a different island from Staffa, though close - does 'inch away from' therefore form part of the clue? can see the answer but don't see how it is 'correct'. Glad to see an anonymous come out. Will do so one day perhaps. Today easy except reinvent, ass and Staffa.
dorsetjimbo
Apr. 26th, 2012 03:31 pm (UTC)
Re: staffa
Chambers: inch-2; Scots and Irish; an island (from the Gaelic innis an island)
kevin_from_ny
Apr. 26th, 2012 05:29 pm (UTC)
I found this somewhat difficult, about 45 minutes or so altogether. EDISON and SLOGGER went in on a wing and a prayer, as I had no idea about Twickenham or big batsmen. I also didn't think that HALVE was necessarily limited to golf, but it possible that in the UK it refers to other sporting ties as well. LOI was REINVENT, where I don't have any particular problem with either lead or pipe. COD to HOME BREW, or LOCUS. Thanks to the setter for dropping in to clarify, but the double BRA did need some added signal, I believe. Thanks to George too, and regards to everyone.
(Anonymous)
Apr. 26th, 2012 10:01 pm (UTC)
"but the double BRA did need some added signal, I believe."

If you have one, two, for for that matter two hundred bras, that is "underwear" no? Can't see the problem.
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